TalkAwhile - The Folk Corporation Forum

I hate to be a miserable toad, but is anybody else slightly disappointed by the £25 camping charge for the festival this year?  With the £64 ticket price (good value) you dont need to be a mathematician to see the end result of £89. 
I understand the reason being given, that extra night time security for the campsites could be needed after last year's increase in theft from tents, but as regular Cropredy goers know that this was an unusual occurrence and that Cropredy is one of the safest festivals around both from a personal and property perspective, indeed this is one of the arguments i use when trying to persuade friends that have not been before to join in and experience a great weekend.
Blame for the thefts has been laid at one or two doorsteps, and i think that the differences to the festival this year from last year will enable everybody to reach their own conclusions.
As many people have themselves experienced over the years, most groups attending Cropredy start off fairly small and grow year upon year (we started off with 4 people in 1985 and our numbers have now swelled to around 25-30 each year from different parts of the country and growing all the time), so if we cut down on vehicles (7 last year) and all park in Banbury and utilise a couple of vans at our disposal to save money on the camping charge then we won't have the available space to site our tents near each other.  So it seems that we will have no options other than to camp seperately or cough up in excess of £175.00. 
After all that, i'm still looking forward to a great weekend with what looks like a promising line up.

Yeah Me & kip were having a bit of a heated debate about this one. He claims to be sure that if we magically teleport the tent there we wont have to pay it cause its a vehicle charge whereas I'm sure because we are camping we have to pay it. First time at cropredy & feeling a little bit hard done by (*mumbles under her breath, it's free camping at truck*)
Vikki xx

Hi Vikki
According to the newsletter i got yesterday it's definitely a camping charge. The festival is still relatively cheap in comparison to other established festi's so don't get too disheartened.  Great to hear that it will be your first Cropredy - welcome aboard i think and hope that you'll have a great time.   

Hope to see you there or maybe not as i am going to invent an invisible spray between now and August so that nobody will be able to see me or my car until we get the tents set up and spray ourselves with anti-invisible spray which i've already invented.

It's free if you're on foot or a biker, so really it's a charge to park your car beside your tent. Not sure if that means you can park in the car park and carry your tent etc to the camping fields and get around it that way. Or just leave the car at home altogether...

The £25.00 is per car, so pile 25 people in a Mini and it's only £1.00 each!  :D

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Couldn't do that in a proper mini!

Disclaimer - I've only read the leaflet (thoroughly) and been twice before, so this is my take on the situation, not official...

To confirm, it's a charge per vehicle so two of you (or a family/group of friends) in a car or a camper-van or whatever would pay one £25 fee for the vehicle.

I  think parking the car in the car park and walking down from there would be frowned upon (I'd frown upon it) but if you can get a lift most of the way - perhaps contributing to someone else's camping fee? - and walk into the village, that's hitch-hiking and is OK...  Discuss...

The comment about not being able to put up eight tents around one transit van is valid though.

And anyway, when the car gets to the back of the queue (can be quite a distance at lunchtime on Thursday or Friday) you'll find that walking is quicker!

Blimeyheck! How about looking at it this way -

we have a whole year between Cropredys, in which to start putting money away for it, bit by bit.

And over a whole year, an extra £25 is probably manageable.

If it will help avoid the theiving situation of last year, that'll be great.

And it wasn't so very long ago that there was a possibility of not having ANY more Croppers at all.

So can we not get into a downer about it?

Fair comment Anji, i think that saving bit by bit is what a lot of people (us included) do anyway, but it is a fairly hefty hike in costs,  especially when we have to put £5 away for the weekend's alcohol consumption. 
I'm certainly not on a downer about it as there are several bands that i'm really looking forward to, as well as meeting a load of old friends.  I don't think that i could contemplate August without Cropredy as it has been part of my life for a long time, it's even to blame for me meeting my wife.
As for the theiving blighters i agree, but i also think that we as Cropredy goers have been a little complacent over security over the years as it has been so safe, and have probably not kept up with the evolution of festivals etc.  Maybe extra vigilance and a few packs of semi starving attack dogs might help.

...I just had the feeling that it makes us a little less rich in spirit, somehow.....  {:-)

                                                                                                    

Take everybody's points, but as has been pointed out it still is a relativly cheap festival. I was in London last night, had a look at listings guide to check out any decent jazz gigs and there were several, but at about the £25 mark each-i.e., the cost of Cropredy camping. We are having to pay over £35 each to watch Van Morrison at a local country house outdoor concert in July. No support act, might rain and he probably won't play more than a couple of hours.(wife's idea not mine).  Look how much more we get at Cropppers for the price. And I'm waiting in trepidation for my daughter to announce she wants to go to Reading festival this year, £135 for 3 days, £60 day tickets- now that is a hefty price! Vicki Rose- some tips: stock up on cans and bottles of booze at the Banbury Tesco's, (just minutes from the festival site, as you come into Banbury off the motorway, you'll see loads of other Fairporters on Thursday and Friday afternoons), village hall or rowing club in Cropredy village if you have to have a cooked breakfast and don't want to cook it yourself; when not drinking cheap supermarket booze, drop into the Cropredy Sports Pavilion, (great pint of Hook Norton) and of course the actual festival bar itself for essential socializing.

£5?  What do you get for that?? Would last me and some of my friends the first hour on Thursday when we get there!

A lot of Festivals charge for camping, vehicle or no!!!
Cropredy camping is free if you're on foot and if you're a biker :)
and as someone else said, you can have more than one tent to a vehicle (within reason)

I reckon that Cropredy is still excellent value for money ;D ;D

mic

Any of you lot actually go camping apart from croppers? I do, and up on the North York Moors or Scarborough in August its around £15 per night to pitch your tent. So cropredy is pretty cheap in comparison!!! ;D ;D

From Rob

hmmm, not sure which way i lean on this one.
crop IS cheap compared to many other festies, but i still think they are ALL too expensive.
and i believe that sleeping in a muddy field is part of the festival experience, and you should not haVE TO PAY FOR THE 'PLEASURE'? OF DOING SO.
AFTER ALL, WHAT DO YOU GET FOR YOUR £25?
BUGGER ALL, THAts what.
(oops sorry, i got me caps in a muddle, not shouting)
on the other hand, we camp a very lot, and £15 a night will get you proper toilets, clean sinks and showers, acommunal washing up kitchen, hot and cold running water and often a laundry and a freezer.

after all, festie camping is no B&B, and i think its appalling to charge extra for it. security? what security?
(discuss.)
if you mean people walking around telling other people to put out their camp fire.........

in my experience of festivals and bike rallies, crop is the only one where we have paid to put our tent up - car parking is another story.
now dont all shout st once, i said 'in my experience'
BTW, sunrise is £25 to park (i think i remember right) for 6 days, camping free,  and the whole festie is £65 for 6 days, as has been said, reading about twice that for three days.
so who's got it right?
maybe there ought to be a 'festival pricing ombudsman'  or whatever they are.........

however, i DO love the fact that crop is one of the only places you can camp next to your car/park next to your tent, so we'll pay the £25 through gritted teeth and shut up now.  when we camp, we camp proper, and i hate lugging kit for miles over rough terrain!

rant over.

ab ;D

There are showers at Cropredy (ok not many ::))... and the extra charge is for more security, because of what happened last year (when a lot of people actually said [at least I think they did] they'd be prepared to pay a bit more for better security.

You do get to camp by your vehicle, and they're not pedantic about how much canvas comes with the vehicle (within reason)

Sleeping in a muddy field may well be part of the festie experience... but not for this old lady anymore ;)  I will miss it in one way, the camaraderie! but my joints won't miss it one little bit :-[ So in order to continue to enjoy the festival, I'll be paying for B&B which adds a lot more to the ticket price than £25... I still think it's worth it (even though as a pedestrian I could camp for free), and it's not the festivals fault that I'm decrepit ;D ;D

Still think it's one of the best value for money festivals. I imagine that festivals where they charge for car-parking but give free camping have simply re-named the charge.

mic

Personally, I'm happy with the camping charge if it improves camp site security. Some people had very frightening experiences, not just having unattended valuables stolen which they should have secured. At night the much maligned Other Place had better security than the fields, where you could walk in and not see any visible security staff at all, let alone be challenged, as I did at 02:00 two nights running. Time will tell.

 [;-)I tend to agree with Bob the Cod, £25 is a bit steep, it was only £15 in 2003, I that's quite a hike even allowing for the extra security. Why can't it just be included in the admission charge and then we wouldn't feel like it was such a big sting. [;-)

Possibly because not everybody camps, I would have thought.........

Oh and welcome to here Finovski :D

Jude

Remember its not just security that has to be paid for. The landowners need to be paid as well. By making these fields available for camping they are potentially having to re house livestock, commit to keeping the land as pasture year in year out when it could possibly be put to more profitable use. Reduction in the yields of 2nd cut silage after the damage caused by the weekends activities and potential damage to forage harvesters caused by abandoned tent pegs, etc, etc.

With farm incomes reducing every year particularly on the small mixed farms typical of the type found around Cropredy I am sure the organisers are having to, rightly, pay these farmers more for the use of this land.

Thanks for the welcome Jude .

I think part of the problem lies in the confusion over whether this is actually a camping or vehicle charge, reading through the responses there seems to be quite a split, with someone even stating that the newsletter regards it is a camping charge. I just think this is a bit baffling if you can then wander or bike in with your tent without having to pay. You'll soon be getting people responding by saying "it's yet another tax on car drivers" and quite amusingly that could be quite difficult to counter.

Like Bob the Cod I've been attending for 20 years and I will continue to go regardless, I also agree that all things considered it is a very reasonably priced event, and even allowing for last years last years unfortuante incidents with stealing it has very probably been the friendliest and safest event to attend of any of our summer festivals, and long may this continue to be the case.

It's definitely a vehicle charge, Finovski. It is a bit of a misnomer though really as, rather than being a camping charge, it's really a "parking your car/van beside your tent" charge.

I understand and appreciate your comments regarding the costs to the Landowners Pete as my family are farmers themselves, but i do think that these issues have been included in the overall ticket price over the years. 
FC have had a pretty good association with the village and landowners over the years and have gone some way to enhancing Cropredy's village life, probably most obviously helping with the superb cricket pavilion, which, for a small village is really very good.
As has been stated before in the newsletter, the camping charge is to enable an increase in nightime security.  One would hope that the small increases in the ticket prices each year which i don't think anybody has issues with, as costs will always continue to rise, would cover these problems.

Ooh Finovski

potentially "another tax on car drivers". Possible "cannus wormicus" there old bean

We do - Buxton at May Bank Holiday, for example, £14.50 per tent per night, and the site is almost sold out!

Okay, you don't have to share facilities with 15,000 people, and the showers are included in the price, but I think £25 for three nights at Cropredy isn't too bad all things considered.

Cheers
Dunc

When you look at it, it's a bit harsh on car drivers, especially as many of those attending will have families and be travelling from all over the country and have no alternative other than to travel by car! Just as a comparison Towersey which I am also off to is £14 per adult to camp and that's for 5 days so in truth it has still cost me and Loz £28 but it runs longer and I believe that unicyclists, naked ramblers, and the much put upon motorist will all have this charge levied on them equally.

Do you reckon that naked rambling unicyclists would have to pay double as they fall into two categories?

I'm not sure, lots of us (myself included) go down on the train, even from up here in the North East. Obviously you've your stuff to carry - though it stops you taking everything but the kitchen sink like some seem to - but other than that it's not that much extra effort. Especially as once you're there it's more trouble than it's worth to try get your car out and drive into Banbury or wherever.

So it's very much an optional thing to take the car, and I would assume it'd be unfair to charge car users & non car users equally as a car takes up much more room on the campsites. Probably it's also easier to check cars for camping tickets, rather than tents.

Also, there's one single charge for a car, no matter how many tents accompany it, and the pedestrian/biker wouldbe charged  per tent.
mic

Unless you have a motorcycle and sidecar of course.


Some people that I know whilst not quite fitting their kitchen sink into the back of the car do take a full set of optics, complete with impressive range of spirits and a range of beers and lagers that Oddbins would be proud of.

One hopes Finovski, that you would'nt be referring to The fishmeister would you?  However, on that subject the range will be massively extended this year by several home-made fruit vodkas,  one of the many reasons one has to bring a car.

I think that's got a lot to do with it. Keep it simple... Plus there's the issue of marshalling cars in and out of the site - not an easy exercise and one that I'd imagine is quite expensive to manage.

A fee for cars will act as a deterent or disincentive for some. It may be that the charge is as much to reduce the numbers of cars descending on the poor village as it is to cover costs of running the camping.

We've seen as much at Beautiful Days. Last year the roads around the site were clogged for hours on the Friday, for locals and through traffic as well as for festival goers. This year there's a more hefty fee for bringing in vehicles at that festival too and I've no doubt that it's partly to deter people to alleviate the traffic problem.

Cheers

Nick

I don't think the charge is excessive - although I can understand the gripes given the tercentage increase on previous years.

we camp around Ireland quite a bit & the average charge is around £15 per night at the more popular sites - so £25 for 3 nights ain't bad..

I've always  found the sites at Cropredy to be well run & looked after. it's handy having your vehicle next to the tent instead of miles away at the car park. It also helps as a sort of vehicular safe for locking up belongings when away from the tent.

i do hope that last year's light fingered chaps ( or ladies - must remember equality of esteem ) aren't going to be a regular occurrence - hopefully the increased funding from the camping charges will allow for increased security.

We will have two small cars and one tent, but to me its still worth it.  How ever my brother has bought a bigger car and we may all squeeze in, but we might have to leave the beer behind, so it will still be two cars, and possibly more stuff ::)

I really do think that 25 quid is getting very steep for camping. especially as there is only ever two of us in that car/tent when we come. I think for 3 nights 15 pounds ought to be the fee for camping. The ticket prices have also risen quite drasically over the last few years too. All in all it really makes me think twice about booking & we actually missed last year due to the price increases.

If we decide to go this year I think I'll be looking into ways of getting there using public transport rather than my own car, as 25 pounds is theft out of my wallet when we've already paid a ticket price for the event.

Y'know, I'm just sitting here wondering how much I'd charge someone to park their car on my front garden for three days........I'm going to have to have a further think.

When you get right down to it, nobody actually forces anyone to go to this or any other festival, I guess what it comes down to in the end is whether you think the festival is worth the cost!

I do :)

mic

Lets not forget that the festival was saved a couple of years ago by the current fab four. They had to start from scratch with no reserves and would have had to bear any losses themselves. As has been quoted before, the first time it makes a loss will be the last time it happens. Do we want this ? Would you take the risk? I am confident that we will not be ripped off. Can this be the last of it?

Well said Sir! By the way, I reckon 25 quid is about right to park on my garden for 3 days. Especially with a tent next to it.

The difference is its not a front lawn but an uneven field full of cow patts

OK the charge for the festival itself is still worth it, especially as its Fairport I'm going to see, everything else is a bonus.

But I'd balk at 25 quid. If there was a voucher for a free breakfast included. Mug of tea or coffee & a sausage & egg bap, then It'd soften the blow to my wallet.

Trouble is, the money made from breakfasts etc, doesn't belong to the Festival organisers.
mic

£8.33 per night including fresh water, toilets, some measure of security, health & safety lighting etc, no illogical rules and regulations. And you camp behind your car (for added security for your spare gear) in some beautiful countryside with church bells in the morning.

50p a week. A pint costs over four times that!

I rest my case (and my rucksack) :)

I couldn't agree more.

And in my life, if something's too expensive, and I can't afford it, I don't have it.

End. Of. Story.

Or d'you want to hear about all the stuff that I think is too expensive? No, I thought not........... ::)

(I predict a riot..... ;D)

I think the camping charges are reasonable. As far as I can see, the organisers are not making enormous profits from the festival, and the can't risk a loss. The cost of things like public liability insurance have rocketed in the last couple of years, which will explain the increased prices. When looking at their business model, you need to look at the overall cost for the festival. They could allow free camping, but the cost would go on the ticket price: not fair on day visitors.

And at least they don't surcharge for size of vehicle like some campsites  ;D

Paul

Yeah, but if a certain amount of the camping fee was alloted in this way in a voucher, the people who make the breakfasts could redeem the vouchers  & everyone might be a little happier, we'd feel we were getting value for money. The organisers would get their camping fees without complaint & the fry up folk would do a roaring trade on all the mornings.

Ah-ha...!!! so you are going to walk there rather than drive then  ;) ;) ;)

So the the camping fee amount would go up by the amount of the breakfasts, which one might not eat.  :D

I'm sorry Tailspin old boy, I'm convinced that no-one is getting rich off of these camping/parking fees and anyway I prefer a good crepe first thing.

Re: costs/breakfast vouchers...
so the cost rises, then the breakfast people redeem the vouchers, the festival organisors pay for the breakfasts, using the extra money from the price rise. Surely this would then negate the original reason for the price rise...the extra security, so what would be the point (apart from making more work for the admin folks).

mic - thinking the original point has been lost :-\

Quite right Mic, the original point...erm....ah yes! I don't believe that the charge is excessive, not at all.  [;-)

well **** it.  i think the charge is excessive.
if we weren't planning on going whatever the lineup, which is also ****, i'd be shouting more.
but we all have a choice, we choose to go.

perhaps unwisely and we really dont like the deal.
but its our choice, so see you there.

I had a kind of brainwave at some ungodly hour of this morning :o

How about, for those that are unhappy with the camping charges, you buy a festival ticket (we all seem to agree that they're great value)... then find a nearby camp-site, where it's cheaper to camp for the duration, problem solved!  [;-)

I mean to say, there must be cheaper camping mustn't there, or no one would think the charge was excessive? ? ? ?

Mic - tongue firmly in cheek (bit of a tight fit, with the foot that lives there) ;) ;)

If it is a camping charge and not a vehicle charge, would it be free to kip in your van? 

I'll be B&Bing it... at the princely sum of £25 (each) per night...for the duration

Worth every penny, just to be there!!!!


mic

re security,i take it that the higher charge is for private security goons?so how come theres a on site police porter cabin?is this in case the middle aged hippies might start a riot,i go to lots of festys but iv never seen a plod cabin at them!and then theres the our brave fire chappies all getting ing for free with their mates!!taking the piss or wot??!!

Should you ever need help from either the police or the fire brigade at the festival, then I hope you will be glad they were there.

Jude

Nicely put, Jude.

Gower Flower

still getting used to these computer thingies!!!!
i shall be attending croppers 2006 on my trusty 1979 bmw motorcycle.
camping charge per night = zilch
camping charge over the entire weekend... still = 'nowt'  !!!!!
Now that's what i call value

Spoken with all the grace of the lady you are Jude :)
mic

I don't remember seeing the police portacabin last year.  And I agree, its worth every penny, three and a bit days parking for £25, a bargain.

I work at lots of festivals and have seen police cabins at most - usually tucked away out of sight or backstage.  There's only Cropredy and Reading where I remember them being so visible.

The police cabin wasn't there last year.
I think there were only ever 4 coppers there at any one time, too.

The picture of the police cabin in the previous program was mine. I never did get credited for it  ::) I suspect the caption was mine as well "A policeman's lot"  ;D

Paul

Which would be one reason to go for my bike test 8)

Not really wanting to open up an old debate- but got the leaflet for Cambridge Folk festival  through the post today- if you think camping charges at Cropredy are steep, well then don't think of going to Cambidge! Musically a great festival and no doubt it will sell out straight away when tickets go on sale this weekend, but I'm not paying those prices to stand or sit in an overcrowded marguee in what is an equally overcrowded  city park, with poor facilities in the main arena camp site, where you can't have your car next to your tent, or a bus ride to the more expensive other camp site on the ring road. Give me Croppers any time, for it's space, music and general rural ambience.

Do what we do - we never know how many are going and in who's cars!!!

Buy the CAMPING tickets on the site (after buying Fest Tickets beforehand) - then do the maths at the bar!!!  I don't mind paying for the Camping Ticket and getting paid in 6X.