TalkAwhile - The Folk Corporation Forum

These two are great albums. Unfortunately, my CD is scratched and won't play.

Any plans afoot to get them released, remastered and regurgitated? (With bonus tracks, liner notes, photographs and lyrics)!

I mean, even Gottle O'Grim is available.

You could try here:

http://www.moodmusic.co.uk/

There is a copy of Tippler's Tales in "Ar Bed Keltiek" in Quimper, Brittany. (I saw it there last week)

If you e-mail him, he may sell it to you.  It was €25.00

http://www.arbedkeltiek.com/bonjour.htm (http://www.arbedkeltiek.com/bonjour.htm)

The Bonny Bunch of Roses CD is available for £8.99 from www.woolworths.co.uk

Thanks guys, but I was hoping that someone had done an "Island" on these and remastered them... with bonus tracks... I've got the Mp3s from my CD that no longer plays, so I'm not overly fussed about getting the same thing again...

Pardon me, Gottle is NOT grim, IMHO!

Nic X

Unfortunately it's unlikely as they're not Island recordings. The best way to find them is secondhand copies of the two albums on one CD release from 1992, which comes up on Ebay occasionally. It tends to go for quire a bit, so if you've got the MP3's you might not want to bother.

LOL, Freudian Slip.

It's not grim - but it's not an album I can listen to all the way through, which is odd, as it's about 25 minutes long! :)

Both here

http://www.moodmusic.co.uk/products.asp?pg=2

Gosh, "In Real Time" - the first Fairport albuim I heard in the 1990s when I was a student (Got it the same day as Liege and Lief! Thanks to my mum and (late) dad when they came down to visit me.) Heh.

I never knew it was fake then - does that invalidate it?

Hi all

Has anyone here bought either of the recent "CD On Demand" versions of Bonny Bunch Of Roses or Tippler's Tales?  If so, am I right in thinking that these are printed onto CDRs rather than CDs?

If so that seems a bit dodgy.  Selling what are basically CDRs with printed off sleeves for 8-10 quid!  And yet I am sorely tempted to go for it, as these two albums are very noticeable by their absence in my collection and I'm dying to hear them.

Alternatively, if anyone out there has a copy of the 1990s "twofer" that they want to sell to me, I'd happily go up to £15 or so.  Please let me know if you can oblige.

Best wishes,

Jules

Technically speaking, all music CD's are CDR's. What do you consider dodgy? As long as the artist gets their dues...

As to waht you buy, well, it's your money and you choose to buy what you want. Like the 30-minute "Ooh La-La" album I once bought from the Faces.

CDRs have a much shorter lifespan than silver CDs, and also aren't compatible with all players.  In a way CD On Demand are legitimising the sale of cheapo copies.  I understand that the reason may be that whoever owns the rights to these two albums doesn't think they'd sell enough to warrant a 'proper' reissue, but when you look at what else is available on everyone's back catalogues these days, it does seem a bit penny pinching of them.

Jules

I find your statement that CDR's have shorter lifespans contradicts my own experience. What's your souce for this?

I admit it's heresay only, from various online music collector forums.  Are you suggesting that CDRs are better than silver discs?  Surely then they'd be the industry standard?  As it is CDRs must be a heck of a lot cheaper to manufacture than silver discs?

Jules

The dual disc that Mood Music sells is manufactured by Sonapress in Birmingham, I believe. No CDRs there....

Hi All
Can I just correct Chris by saying the link with sonopress was altered some time back and the discs in question are manufactured under the term CDO authorised by Universal records.
Reprinted below is a posting I made some while back on the active section regarding CDO.

Steve

The term on demand can be used for the CDO format but that does not accurately describe the product.
Yes the disc is made to order but is of a quality that in some cases is better technically than mass produced items. Just because a disc is mass produced does not mean it is automatically superior to other products, there are some very poor quality CD producers out there taking good money from struggling up and coming artists.
The quality of the disc inserts and content thereof is really down to the commissioning owner of the content. Take the Universal archive Bonny Bunch product mentioned this is indeed minimal in content and information but that is only because the record company have ordered it that way and is part of a huge back catalogue re-issue.. The idea behind a lot of CDO content is to make old, unavailable and deleted stock once again available on disc at a reasonable price.
IMHO the important part is the music, kept to its original form without the rip off of dubious quality bonus track added to justify a price hike.
You pay your money and take your choice.
CDO can be used and indeed is being used to create product for new bands or to re-issue product as required, see the recent re-issue of “Tipplers Tales”, but again I come back to the amount of sleeve content being the decision of the commissioning owner.
Products are available with multiple page booklets printed to retail quality and shrink wrapped prior to dispatch. It is only because the disc is declared that it is a CDO format that anyone would know the difference.
Another advantage to this system is that other items such as a PC operating data pack can be added with all sorts of other extras, see the pack on the “One for Jonah” disc.
I don’t wish to use this posting as an unmerciful plug for our own products but I will be happy to continue this discussion with anyone who wants more info.

But that doesn't answer the question, Steve....

Are the blanks of CD or CDR quality?....

I can't think that there will be more than one version of the discs available at this time, so all sellers must be selling the CD On Demand version.  I've done a little searching on the web and have found the following blurb.  It seems that they do use CDRs, but they are 'silver coloured' ones.  Quite what the difference between a 'silver coloured' CDR and a regular CD is, I don't know.  And I quote:-

"CDs - ON DEMAND! During the last 20 years, while CDs have remained the public's music format of choice, manufacturing technology has advanced to the point where professional pressings can be made to order. This is great news for the many old classics, rarities, and titles that you may only have on vinyl - albums thought to be lost to the archives forever, now available again through CD On Demand.

CD On Demand is an officially manufactured product; the re-released albums are exact copies of the music from the original recordings and have the same cover artwork. Packaging is kept to a basic generic format, using booklet cover artwork. While it is a simplified version of the original pressing, it has passed all the record companies' quality checks for audio content and artwork reproduction

HOW DOES IT WORK? The music is digitised and manufactured to the CD without audio compression, i.e. "Red Book" standard. The CD's physical specifications, tracks, and sampling are as per the original masters. This ensures the listener is hearing the music in its full recording quality.

The processes used for the manufacture of CD On Demand takes CDR technology to a new dimension. The CDs are an audio-optimised CDR media with a true silver coloured surface. The CDRs we are using are fully compatible with any CD-Audio or CD-ROM player."

So it sounds respectable enough, but it's still basically a CDR in a jewel case with very basic artwork.  I'm still hoping to find a copy of the 1992 "twofer" edition myself.

Jules

The technical spec as required by Universal is equivalent to that found on the best CD production.
I emphasise "best"; as I mentioned before some mass manufacture is very much less in quality than "best"
One of the delaying factors in getting the CDO thing off the ground was the quality issue.
I am not sure of the exact figures and they are probably under some kind of confidentiality clause anyway but as I understand it out of the thousands of discs produced so far there have been almost no returns for reasons of quality.

Steve

Many thanks for enlightening me - I certainly wasn't expecting anyone involved in CDO to be a poster on this forum!

Jules

I don't know why, but this made me laugh. So, just to clarify, there have been some returns for reasons of quality then...  ;D

The whole world is here mate, you would suprised at what level of strange and mysterious beasts hang around this corner of th'interweb!  ;D

"I don't know why, but this made me laugh. So, just to clarify, there have been some returns for reasons of quality then"

Sorry I haven't yet figured out the quote box.

In regard to returns the rate is less than so called normally produced Cd's which by the way we also retail  :-X sorry no plug meant here

The important bit is the music and the fact that it is available again.

Steve

CDRs and "normal" CDs are different - normal CDs are pressed, whereas a CDO is burnt using a CDR with a layer of dye.

So, to summarise, CDR's and CDO are the same, so-called traditional CD's are different.

But there's no appreciable differnce in terms of returns / quality / longevity acoording to the manufacturer.

Is that right?

By the way, every CD I buy is immediately backed up in lossless format on my server. This, after long experience of CD's going missing, being eaten by the hippos etc. So I have insurance against their theft by my kids, faults developing, etc. And yes my server is backed up.

can i suggest robert Johnsons 32/20 blues, .............................blow her half in two!!
that should deal with the hippos

Are you sure? LPs were pressed, I can't see how you can press a digital format...

The metal layer inside a CD is pressed to create a pattern of indentations/holes that correspond to the ones and noughts of the digital signal. The reading laser is then affected by the pattern of pits in the surface, so reading the digital data stream.

In a CDR the metal layer is replaced by a dye-based layer which is burned by a writing laser. The burning causes pits to appear in the surface that appear to the reading laser to have a similar effect as the metal layer. So CD players can read CDRs in the same way that they read CDs.

The CDR burning process only gives a 'similar' effect to a CD surface though and the tolerances on what constitutes a 1 or a 0 are different. This can mean that some CD players cannot read some CDRs.

Cheers

Nick

See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compact_disc