TalkAwhile - The Folk Corporation Forum

Do we know about this?
http://blurt-online.com/news/view/4099/

"Rhino Handmade drops it on Oct. 12 and the remastered release will now boast a bonus CD featuring 11 unreleased live performances from the tour that the duo embarked upon shortly after its release...

The bonus disc documents the tumultuous tour with 11 unreleased live performances, all but one taken from shows in San Francisco and Santa Cruz, California. The songs draw from the Thompsons' records together, including three from the album, "Back Street Slide," "Did She Jump Or Was She Pushed?" and the title track; "Borrowed Time" from Sunnyvista (1979); "Pavanne" from First Light (1978); and "For Shame Of Doing Wrong," "Dargai," and "Dimming Of The Day" from Pour Down Like Silver (1975). Several covers are also featured: Hank Williams' "Honky Tonk Blues," "I'm A Dreamer" by Fairport Convention singer Sandy Denny, and Bob Dylan's "I'll Keep It With Mine," a song Richard covered with Fairport Convention on 1969's What We Did On Our Holidays."

 

We do now... ;D

Nice one..

Great news, this'll go nicely alongside my boots of Rafferty's Folly and some live recordings from the SOTL tour. The band for this tour consisting of Nicol, Mattacks and Pete Zorn on bass (the "you're not Dave Pegg" tour as posters had already been printed before asking Peggy if he was available). Will have to buy this to see if the performances are the same as those on the boot.

...and another one for the Amazon shopping basket...   :o

Jules

I have both of those CDs, but that's only about a quarter of the album.

Jules

I think they missed a trick by not including the Gerry Rafferty version of the album as the second disc - with maybe live tracks added on as extras, or as a separate release.

The album as released is still the one (they were right to drop Modern Woman and Wrong Heartbeat, and right to redo Wall Of Death with Richard singing instead of Linda), but the Rafferty version has nice versions of Backstreet Slide, Just The Motion and Walking On A Wire.

Jules

I'm sure there will be many differing opinions about the bonus CD, didn't Frank K (I'm still waiting for those cassettes you promised me in return for the Mary Costello shows!!!) record some of the Richard & Linda Band US tour shows with properly set up mics? Perhaps the bonus CD contains some of those??

Yes, it's coming.....

http://www.rhino.com/article/shoot-out-the-lights-reloads

Cool, 'cos it's been weeks since I last, y'know, bought an album I'd already bought at least twice before.

Oooh, that's very sharp Dave.  ;D ::)

But spot on.

I wish I'd only bought the bloody thing twice  ;D

I notice  "Living In Luxury" is missing.

that wasnt on the errr...unofficial versions either
only the japanese version,hmmmm wonder why
was it perhaps not from the same sessions?

Nope. It's on my Hannibal copy  with UK EAN code.

That's the one that RT demanded be withdrawn because he disliked that track.

I'd not heard that. Thanks, Andy.

Mind you, it's not the most dodgy thing he's ever had released.  :)

So I notice this is a Rhino release.  Does that mean it'll be like their Handmade series and only available direct from them as an expensive import with a hefty import duty on top?  Because I'm not seeing it at Amazon.  Anyone seen it offered as a pre-release anywhere?

Jules

Sure is Handmade, Jules, but it's worth checking Spin in Newcastle as they often have stock.
Steve

Good idea, Steve!  I will.

Jules

P.S. Just checked, there's no sign of it at their site just yet.

i have just read the page that Chris posted up at the top of the thread, signed up for e-maithers and seen this at the very end of the message
ahem....."You won’t find this in any store or anywhere else online, so don't miss out! To find out when this limited edition is available for pre-order, sign up for the Rhino Handmade Newsletter above."

so there you have it

I still reckon Spin will get copies in.  They have for previous Handmade releases.

Jules

Re: Living in Luxury.
The song did come out of the same sessions & was first released as the 'B' side of the single Don't Renege on our Love.
As Andy said RT demanded its withdrawal from all subsequent releases on CD after it had appeared on the initial Hannibal CD release.  I believe there was some kind of quid pro quo when he agreed this with Joe Boyd - was it not that RT allowed the release of Small Town Romance on CD if Living in Luxury was removed?
Actually a few of the early RT CD releases appeared with Bonus Tracks that were not on the vinyl albums - As well as Living in Luxury there was Where the Wind Don't Whine on Hand of Kindness & Shine on Love on Across a Crowded Room.  RT, though, has always been opposed to this practice - as he's made clear many times in interviews.  I kind of understand his point but I'm glad these bonus tracks are out there.

So it sounds like those of us who already have at least one copy of the original album won't be able to just get hold of the live tracks by downloading them from iTunes, or whatever.  It'll be the whole package or nowt...

Not sure - I've noticed previous Rhino Handmade releases having download options.  Again, it was direct from their site only.

Jules

What were the dates of the San Francisco and Santa Cruz shows?

Perhaps not:
"You won’t find this in any store or anywhere else online, so don't miss out! To find out when this limited edition is available for pre-order, sign up for the Rhino Handmade Newsletter".
http://www.rhino.com/article/shoot-out-the-lights-reloads

By the way, we seem to have two separate threads running about this now (Chris started another one last week).

To echo a couple other posters, I was excited when I read the subject, and assumed that it was going to be Rafferty's Folly finally released officially.  Live tracks are always welcome, but I think more people would prefer Rafferty's Folly.

On the other hand, I suppose the whole point of Rafferty's Folly is that Thompson wasn't pleased with how the originally version of the album came out and didn't want it released, so why would he want it out now?    

As a historical document.  If it was the 2nd disc, it wouldn't be replacing the version he wanted, just showing how it all went down.  Fans would like that.  I think RT himself would understand that, but h's probably had little or nothing to do with this reissue anyway.

Jules

I'm not so sure. He always seems to me to be fairly obsessive about controlling his catalogue, hence the shenanigans around Small Town Romance & Living in Luxury, his dislike of bonus tracks on reissues and a strident attitude towards unauthorised live recordings.

I think it is a bit of a pity. Artists rarely seem to me to be the best judge of their own material.

However, it is their material.

Indisputably.

I think when he can have a say, he'll have one, but not sure whether he still has any bargaining power over his back catalogue from that era.

I agree with what you said about artists and their own material.

Jules

The e-mail that I've just got has it at $39.98

`

same here
 so that probably means we'll end up being asked £40 to buy this
do you ever get the feeling that we are just cash cows for an old record with a live show stuck on, should be £12, tops

Indeed, but as the owners of these companies know all too well, there are enough of us to shell out these crazy amounts to buy something again we already bought 2 or 3 times before..Its the perfect example of capitalism..

But possibly not as poor judges as really enthusiastic fans... I suspect some of us would be happy to buy a CD of RT tuning up a guitar with notched frets and knackered strings - and thoroughly enjoy listening to it!

when i start baulking at the prices being asked for reissues the i'm sure i am not alone.
Its aimed at the poor galoots like me who have already shelled out over and over again for stuff they first bought years ago and if they thought that there really was a market for this then it would be freely available not an on demand bespoke affair.
for the sort of money being asked($40+p&p) at the moment i would expect a lot more than a live show some photographs and an essay  telling me how bad the Thompsons marriage was at the time but how the music didnt suffer

stick it up your arse Ryko

I'm not paying £40.  If I find it for £30, I'll bite, but £40 is a joke.

Jules

that's forty US$, not pounds....

 the rule of thumb is if its $40 in the states then its £40 over here

us$51 including P&P to the UK. 33 of your UK Pounds.

...plus the customs charges!

Jules

i didnt mean exchange rates, have you been to the states and noticed something costing, say, $40, if available over here will set you back £40

but even at £33 + possible customs charges it's at least £21 + possible customs charges too much

Any suggestions?

Someone will have to shell out the $40 to find out ...

It's in Clinton Heylin's booklet but my copy disappeared years ago!

I've waited years for a deluxe version of Shoot Out The Lights. Of course it would have to include the Rafferty sessions and 'Living in Luxury' as an absolute bare minimum requirement. It would also have to retail at around twelve quid, or a bit more if they put some effort into the packaging.

This fails on almost every level.

At forty quid (it'll actually be more than this with customs charges), I'd expect at least four discs and possibly a dvd.

Think I'll stick with the Japan import which at least includes 'Living in Luxury'.

Last 2 dates of the tour:
4 June - The Catalyst, Santa Cruz  (Linda not present)
6 June -  Great American Music Hall, San Francisco

I didn't know Linda had failed to show for one of the gigs.  Times must have been very edgy indeed!

Jules

According to Joe Boyd, after he witnessed Linda singing "the show of her life" at The Roxy in LA, he quickly decided to record the next two (which were the final two) shows. But after The Roxy, Linda collapsed and was looked after by Linda Ronstadt which was why she missed Santa Cruz.

I knew about the collapse and Linda R, but didn't know she missed a show.

Jules

[/quote]

It's in Clinton Heylin's booklet but my copy disappeared years ago!
[/quote]

Just checked Heylin's book & it doesn't list any west coast dates for R< on that tour, but does note 2 dates (Detroit, 27/05/82 & Catalyst, Santa Cruz 04/06/82) as just RT+band, the latter date enigmatically notes "plus fiddle-player", who isn't named. The set list for the Catalyst includes "Sloth", which also featured on some of the east coast dates, but can't remember which until I dig the tapes out of the bunker. So, it looks as if Linda missed at least two dates & presumably there were other west coast shows other than Santa Cruz & GAMH. Is there a definitive list out there?

2 absolutely dynamite versions of I'm a Dreamer on 6 June 1982!

The 4 June gig is introduced as the Richard Thompson Band - great playing!!

Twice in the same gig?!

Jules

Lots of early & late shows on that tour.

Ah right, gotcha!

Jules

Funny how they were treated as 2 separate shows in the US. We just have the 1st and 2nd half in the UK with an interval in between.

thats because they were separate shows, just like a matinee performance and an evening show here in blighty

"The band, meanwhile, kept their heads down and amazed the Yanks with their precision and power. Richard was his usual genius self, only more so"

Absolutely correct, the power on those 2 gigs is phenominal 8)

Am I alone in feeling a bit reluctant about playing something that documents a thoroughly bad period in two peoples' lives? (Not to mention the band, ducking the bottles!)

That's not to say I wouldn't buy the set eventually, but I can see myself wincing while listening to it, having seen the two of them perform a hell of a lot of times when everything was presumably going hunky dory.      

   

Richard suggests in many an interview (not always totally convincingly imho!) that a lot of the 'great break-up songs' are actually nothing of the sort...

why? its well documented and was done in public 30 years ago
but wince away
 a few years ago RT toured with his lad on rhythm guitar and i wondered how he felt as his old fella sang"She twists the knife again"

I think Ed means the live document, when the sh*t truly was hitting the fan.

Jules

Exactement Jules.

In the 1970s a bunch of us used to go and see Richard and Linda (and Simon) and we felt fortunate to do so - they premiered most of "Hokey Pokey" at one venue for instance.

We then found that we couldn't go to gigs as Richard had decided not to perform any more (for his own legitimate reasons). However we carried on buying the records and telling everybody how good R & L were. We then saw them at Cropredy and thought ello ello, something's up here! Also when "Shoot Out The Lights" came out we wondered why the cover art was like that.

Next thing we read that Linda's throwing things at Richard (for HER own very legitimate reasons). I know we're all just punters but it was a bit horrible at the time and I'm not sure that I love the sound of breaking relationships (& glass) enough to buy the set.        

But of course great art is often born from pain......

Jules

My copy arrived yesterday evening..nice booklet style package with photos and interviews/essays from those involved.  Have listened on the way to work to Dargai/Shoot out the Lights/Borrowed Time from the live CD - the latter comprising some brilliant soloing from RT and some clear rhythm playing from Mr. SN (always good to hear him on the electric).  Sounds like it was all recorded in front of 30 die hards in a small room.  So far very pleased and the live album is more engaging thus far than the live 1975 set...

That's saying a lot because I adore that 1975 live CD.

So, anyway, let's cut to the chase - how much did it cost you, all in?

Jules

Just over $40 with current exchange rates.  I rationalized to myself on the basis that I don't have a CD copy of SOTL and would pay $20 for one and if the live CD was issued as a stand alone I'd pay $20 for that..I don't think I had to pay any postage and there weren't any border service charges etc.

Not bad.  I don't think anyone in the UK would be quite so lucky.

Any UK TAWers got this yet?

Jules

I've been charged just over £30. Yet to arrive, so I don't know whether there are any customs / VAT to pay yet.

Let us know how you get on, Chris.

Jules

I just received mine in the mail yesterday and have yet to listen.  It's packaged like a book, with the lengthy booklet stapled between the covers.  The booklet is beautiful, lots of photos of R&L and the band, with remembrances from Joe Boyd, Dave Mattacks, Pete Zorn, etc.  I bought it direct from Rhino for $40.00 U.S.  I'll have to pop the remastered Rubber Soul out of my car stereo and slip in the live R&L disc.

I just got a letter from customs. I don't know for certain it's for the item in question, but it's likely. £4.46 VAT, which isn't that bad, but the thing that always winds me up is that these thieves make you pay an additional £8.00 admin fee for the privilege of charging you the VAT!

I get a lot of stuff sent from the US & I don't get caught often, but when I do, it always makes me feel like I've been mugged.

Yeah the admin fee is always the killer!  And yes, mugging is about right.   >:(

Jules

OK, it was the R< CD, so....

Initial cost £33.40
Customs ransom charge £12.46

Total £45.86  :(

Never again!

It is a lovely package though...

"...with remembrances from Joe Boyd, Dave Mattacks, Pete Zorn, etc."

Missing in action Simon Nicol AFAICS. Everybody knows how difficult it is to reach him for a reaction  :-\

Ooh, I feel your pain, Dave.

See, that's why I can't bring myself to order it.  I must check with the guys at Spin - might be my only hope outside of a 2nd hand copy cropping up on eBay....

Jules

Having said that, VAT of 4.46 gives a cost of 25.48, rather than 30+ quid.....it could have been more, I guess.

OK, I have to say for the record that I DON'T LIKE HIDDEN TRACKS!
It's not that I object to having these little extras... far from it, but I would like them listed on the insert please. I can live without the hassle of trying to work out what it is thank you very much.

In this case it's a cover of the Everly Brothers, 'The Price Of Love', on the end of the live disc.

Yes but everybody knows Price of Love by the Everly Brothers on the pretty Warner Brothers label, red if I remember, more recently covered by Buddy & Julie Miller!!

You've lost me Chris - did someone land a copy for £25.48?  I'd pay that.

Jules

No - that's what HMRC charged VAT on, rather than the £30+ we have paid....don't ask me why, though...

So that was on top of the price of the CD?   >:(

They do seem to have a very inexact scale of measurement.

Jules

oh yes....

Still, the live album is definitely worth getting  - its a shame that it hasn't been issued separately as I am sure there are plenty of people willing to fork out 15 quid or so..The current package would be like Island issuing the live 1975 set as part of a 2 CD repackage of Pours Down..and selling for 25 quid.

Back to the music.  RT in fine form and his soloing seems less "noisy" than more recent works.  Great versions of For Shame of Doing Wrong, Borrowed Time, SoTL, I'll Keep it with Mine (recording of this not such good quality) Back Street Slide and Dimming of the Day (all the more poignant given the circumstances of the recording).  The vocals occasionally sound a little wayward, not surprisingly.  It does give a much better idea of a genuine live performance than say the 10 minutes of Whitesnake live 2004 I saw yesterday afternoon - loads of overdubs on Cov's screechy vocals.

Ah, well, we're all in it together, I suppose it's cheaper than chasing taxes from them with more money than we'd know what to do with.   ;)

I remembered to do so today, but alas they say they can't get any Rhino Handmade titles in stock right now.   :(

Jules

I paid £12.46 in taxes & collection charge. So yes, unfortunately over £40.....in total

callling Barry ....

This has now appeared on the UK Rhino site - although it's still expensive at £27.29 including postage - no tax however! Try clicking on Folk or searching for Thompson - searching for Richard T doesn't produce it.
http://www.rhino.co.uk/

Clive

Thanks Clive - I think that's a price I can deal with.

Jules

£3.20 postage for a cd within the uk!
pisstakers
but then thats their pricing policy, £24 for a double cd, still not on

They should say "£3.20 for postage, packing, and some nice profit for us".  At least that would be honest.

Jules

I've had an opportunity to hear the live CD and I'd urge anyone with even a passing interest in R and/or LT to do the same. It really is a remarkable piece of work, with some incendiary performances all round. Their version of "I'm A Dreamer" is amazing.

Mine, ordered from Rhino UK, was delivered by UPS and came from Gutersloh, Germany.

Got mine from UK Rhino yesterday, similarly via Germany.  £27.29 doesn't seem so bad compared to the initial import pricetag.  So I feel I can say 'result'!  Beautifully packaged by the way.

Jules

I agree.  The packaging and the booklet are one of the most informative in recent years.

Just a warning as I'm not sure if I've been ripped off or just a big error on the Rhino website
I had followed the discussion here and decided I couldn't do without Shoot Out the Lights
went to order it online but was surprised to see once I had clicked to put it in my basket
that it contained 2 items, on looking my basket also contained and mp3 download of a single
by The Darkness....ok as it showed it cost £0:00 and it didn't have a 'remove from basket'
ok a freebie so I continued
When the postage came up it seemed about a pound more expensive I remembered reported here
but never mind I went ahead without looking too hard at things
When I reviewed my email what did I see

Order Summary:
1 x Shoot Out The Lights (Deluxe Album): CD Album @ 23.99 GBP
1 x Christmas Time (Don't Let The Bells End) DMD UPC: The Darkness - Don't let the Bells End MP3 @ 0.99 GBP
1 x The Darkness - Don't let the Bells End MP3 @ 0.00 GBP

Just be warned, I may wait till I have the CD safely delivered before I kick up a fuss
but I don't think I made any slips while ordering
Cheers
Bryan

The worst thing about this tale is that someone may see your receipt and think you like The Darkness.  It's a bloody outrage!!   :o >:(

Jules

I couldn't stand the shame  :-[

There is the prospect that The Darkness might become "hip" again in several years' time..

I am sure you will find the R & LT set worth every penny and the extra quid for The Darkness..

Bizarre - though I suppose you get Darkness if you Shoot Out the Lights!

Gold ****dex coat on & running...

I ordered this CD on the 22nd Dec & I'm still waiting for it (I thought I would give them the time to send it taking into account Xmas & New Year).

On Tuesday I checked my account which said Order received. The site said that the CD was in stock so Emailed Rhino to ask where my order was to which they replied that it was out of stock & they weren't sure when they were getting anymore.

They asked did I want to cancel the order to which I replied as I had waited this long I might as while wait a bit longer.

I pointed out to them that there site was incorrect in saying it was in stock & a message to let me know about it would have helped.

If I were you I'd cancel and ask them to let you know if they ever get any stock.

Why give them free money you could be spending on, say, Festival Bell?

I'm glad I didn't take your advice Andy because "Surprise Surprise" the CD's turned up in the post today with paperwork dated the 28th Jan the day after they had emailed me to say it was out of stock.

No explantion or apology as to why they have suddenly found either my order or a new CD.

I will still purchase Festival Bell at the Wintour gig in Margate.

Just shows how unpredictable these things are. Enjoy the CD!

The live cd is phenomenal.