TalkAwhile - The Folk Corporation Forum

Kingsley Abbot writes a 5 page article on Sandy Denny in the latest Record Collector magazine. He closes with some personal reflections on Fairport and their Ladies closing with a challenge: suggesting FC record with Kelly While!  Great idea!

I'd like to see/hear that line-up  :)

Much as i would welcome it I dont think it will happen, one off's apart, like 2008's Sandy tributes.

Kelly has a full time job with Mike Harding's show....

That hardly precludes some recording sessions with Fairport though, does it?

Nancy Wallace has a full-time job but she somehow manages to combine it with her music career.

What would the general reaction be if Kellie guested on the next FC album - on one track or the whole thing, and then couldn't repeat it live on the road?....

One track would be a highlight, not sure about the whole album?...

With respect Philip, how many gigs a year does Nancy do?.....Kellie wouldn't be able to do more than the odd show, and possibly Cropredy (If Harding was present)

Pedant alert...  I'm sure the lady in question is Kellie rather than Kelly...  ::)

whoops - of couse, sorry Kellie!

I don't know Chris, from what I gather Kingsley Abbot has suggested that FC record with Kellie While and you seemed to be suggesting that this would be impossible because she has a job. I imagine the reaction of the faithful would be slightly less muted than when Richard Thompson and Jerry Donahue appeared on "Hanks for the Memory" and were unable to go on tour and replicate it, but broadly similar. Mind you, I also have a full time job, but if I were invited to join Fairport Convention on tour I might consider taking a short leave of absence from work.

Kellie sang WKWTTG with FC at The Teenage Cancer Trust gig at The Royal Albert Hall in 2009 (she was there to cover the show with Mike Harding and was spontaneously asked to perform), did a great job as well, but as for actually joining the band, maybe not. Special guests, however, are always a welcome addition to any FC recording, and it's always fun to have special guests at a certain festival, but the core 5-piece unit should stay the same for now.

AS Kellie is unlikely to give up her secure, well-paid job, I'm mindful to agree with Dan O.

A whole album with a guest artist, not likely to join up, certainly seems odd to me. Change the name of the artist on the album, then great, bring it on.

Woops, my fault, sorry Kellie!  Copied it from RC without checking.

That guitar of Donovan's crops up everywhere ;D Mind you its guested with RT.

With the greatest respect, I reckon Kellie's probably the best judge of what she can and can't do professionally!

Nobody on here has the slightest idea what her working arrangements are, what the deal is with Smooth Operations, or what jobs she'd take (or like to take) if they were offered. And forgive me but why on earth would Mike Harding have to be present for her to perform at Cropredy?!

In reply to Joss's original post, it'd be great to hear Kellie and/or her mother record with Fairport again.

Because he#s likely to be elsewhere at that time of year?....

I still rate Chris While as the best replacement for Sandy Denny, but Kellie is probably the best of the rest, as evidenced by her John the Gun at Cropredy 2008.

Saw both Kellie and Chris join Fairport on stage at Southport for WKWTTG a few years back. Now that was good! I think they released it as a download only single. In fact I'm sure I downloaded it but I can't find it anywhere.

Did I dream it??

Ummmmm why would any singer want to be a replacement for Sandy? Or sing the songs that were once sung by her?

Surely the whole point would be to discover, arrange and play a whole new different set of songs, either newly written by the band, the singer or others and make full use of the new dynamic to be found with the addition of female vocals...

And that really would change FC once again :)

Yes indeed, Jude.  But hopefully the singer in question would also tackle some old Sandy vocal tunes from time to time in concert, for the sake of history and tradition.  But yes, otherwise I agree with you, and so wish it would happen.

Jules

"This is not a tribute band" was memorably said by Simon and a female singer would be great, but not to be a replacement for Sandy Denny, destined to fail in that role - for who could succeed? Frankly I'm rather tired of this endless obsession with a woman singer "replacing" Sandy. Yes, she was a great singer in a great band, but she's been dead these 32 years and that version of the band has been dead longer still.

IF Fairport Convention wished to reinvigorate themselves with a female singer again, that'd be great, especially if it led to new material being written and performed by the new version of the band.

But I don't think the putative new singer should be forced to try and emulate someone who has achieved a status in death that makes it almost impossible for them to follow. Let them strike out in a new direction, not travel on the same old worn down pathways.



Edit: Just read Jude's reply, with which I agree wholeheartedly

I'm with andy and Jude, great as fairport are it would be nice to see them move forward.

I agree wholeheartedly with both comments. I find all the "Sandy substitutes" rather pale by comparison with the original and don't understand why there is a fascination in trying to recreate what cannot be recreated. No one expected Dave Mattacks to play as a substitute for Martin Lamble, why expect any musician to impersonate another (tribute bans excepted).

We already have a ready made Lady singer for Fairport, surely?  ;)

I completely agree with Jude and Andy  ( but i always had a soft spot for Vikki Clayton singing Sandy songs........ anybody who could have a band called the Nerve doing Sandy songs.......................................)

My knees quiver at the very thought, one of my all time favourite singers is Vikki :)

Maybe I risk being drummed out of TAW and lightning striking my hung, drawn and quartered body, but I really don't understand the way Sandy is treated with such veneration. She was good, but she was only one of many good female singers at the time and Fairport wasn't Sandy any more than Sandy was Fairport. The whole was then, and has been ever since, greater than its constituent parts.

It would be great to see Fairport bringing in a female singer occasionally when material allows for it - might even be nice to have a woman writing for Fairport again too, but I fear she will always be compared with the sainted Sandy.

and hence our dear Jude!

Interesting points AM  :)

I agree they should never try and replace Sandy. But, I do have a preference for female singers in folk music.

So recruit a new full time female vocalist with FC and also add a rock guitarist. I feel that with these additions they could move forward to even greater heights. Now who these two musicians should be is the question.

Probably best left to the band.

Julianne Regan has always been my favourite guest (as opposed to original) Fairport singer, not least because she's her own woman and sings her own take on the material.

But the key point for anything other than an occasional guest slot is always the one that we rarely find out about: can the rest of the band work happily with them and can they work happily with the rest of the band... Until you've been there you have no idea how corrosive the cliched muscial differences actually are...

If it comes up sounding at least 10% as good as Kellie's superb take on A Sailor's Life at the Barbican last year, then I'm in.  I certainly prefer her voice to Chris's While and Leslie.

does anyone really expect FC to expand to a 7 piece with all the implications that has?
if were adding guitarists and singers why not add a ukulele prodigy and a keyboard wizard while were at it, and a brass section.

this is an utterly pointless thread

Fairporthead anyone?  ;D

dont back against it

The door's over there, Jim.

She died before her time, which is always a good way to increase your fame rating. Not recomended though.

Paul

She wasn't good, Andy. She was the best interpreter of English folk song and the finest English female singer-songwriter of her generation. I was lucky enough to see her perform with and without Fairport on several occasions - including the famous Albert Hall gig - and her performances were nothing short of spine-tingling.

This is not the rose-cloured tint of retrospection. I thought so at the time - and no singer I have seen since has come anywhere near generating the same power in a live performance.

What I loved about Chris While doing Liege and Lief at Cropredy that time was that Chris wasn't impersonating Sandy, but singing the songs as Chris While. Which is why if they did bring in a female vocalist - which I'd love them to - she should be her own woman, just as Jude says.

Possibly move in a different direction but I think as a band they are always moving - but nit always in the direction I would wish them to.

A full time female singer would be OK, especially if they also played a mean electric guitar though.

She is only two steps away. Albion Xmas Band ;)

My goodness! How on earth does she get the time off work?  ::)

it's about a fortnight worth of gigs....holidays maybe? At a very quiet time of year for Mike?.....

I would love there to be a full time female vocallist, although personally I would prefer a second full time song writer given the choice (whocan also play electric guitar).

Any Female singer/songwriter electric guitarists who sound a bit(bot not too much) like Sandy and are out of work spring to mind  :o

I think they should recruite Stephen Hawking on vocals.

I was listening to the Cropredy '08  version of John The Gun just the other day, and realised that I have been wrong all this time. I often compared Kellie's voice to her mother's voice, in such a way that I would say 'She sings like here mum, but not as good!' but I have realised it's not like that at all!

They both have great and very different voices, hence why they both get different work rather than Kellie always working with her Mother. It's nice to see them working together, but it's also great to see Kellie singing with The Albions, and Chris singing with Fairport back in 2007, and all the other While related things.

Hi AM. Sorry tried to post this once and failed!
Veneration is a strong word. As is said so many times on this site all our opinions are subjective and personal. For me, Sandy's first stint with the band was
when all the components came together. Sandy's voice, the songs she brought to the band, Dave S and RT inventing the great art of weaving lines and writing, Mattacks drumming etc. Again as has been said before, you probably fall in love with the version of the band  you hear for thr first time. Hearing Sailors Life for the first time ,over 40 yrs ago now, was one of those moments that made me start to explore,folk clubs, Nick Drake, John Martyn,Pentangle, Albions, Steeleye, ISB etc and continuing to try and explore 'new' music and musicians up to today.
At home I will often listen to Vikki Clayton singing WKWTTG , but i will go back to that yr of Fairport with Sandy when they did produce a genre that had not been heard before.
Again subjectively, I cannot think of anyone at the time who could match  the power and intonation of Sandy's voice live. (Cleo Laine possibly but Cleo and Fairport!!!!!) ' You used to say, do do do doobie do be do, there'd come a day, dah dah do do doobie dah' I digress...........

I don't know...maybe we should ask the many who have tried...(even if it was only for a couple of days in a field in August)...

And yes, I am being rather facetious.  

But seriously, I can think of a thousand reasons why a vocalist would want to try (although the word 'replacement' is hanging in the ether uncomfortably there.  We all know that's an impossibility) .  

Objectively I think another female vocalist tackling new material (and the odd oldie, but maybe not just oldies that were sung by Sandy...) would be the kick up the posterior that could give the current, in my opinion only, rather stagnant, lineup a genuine exciting boost.  But, somehow even expressing an opinion like this makes me rather uncomfortable (even though this is supposed to be about opinions.  Isn't it?)..

Interesting to read all the points..............

Is it only the men who would like a female vocalist?  ;)

Apart from the Liege and Lief set, I tend to, oddly, lose some interest when there is a female singer  :-X

I remember watching Fairport, with Sandy, as my first live gig............what sticks in my mind from then is Swarb :-[  (It takes all sorts  :-X)

Strangely, I know a Cropredy attender, not a TAWer, who still won't forgive Ric for not being Swarb.
The way he moans on about 95% of the acts, I don't know why he bothers going to see Fairport anymore.

There is someone on the FC List like that.  ???  :-\

A few interesting and varied points made over the last few pages...

I'd love to see Kellie work with Fairport more often, in whatever capacity. She's got a wonderful voice (and, er, 'casing'  :P) that would really add something to the Fairport sound, including some wonderful 4-part harmonies.  :) Whether this would be practical or not, or whether the band wish to do such a thing is neither here nor there, it's all hypothetical anyway.

I've only really discovered Sandy over the last few years, and obviously only have her recorded output to go on. I'm inclined to agree with Muse.  :o :-X Her albums are not albums that I come back to often, but I do love her work with early Fairport. It seems that the majority in the Sandy camp saw her live, which may have a lot to do with their slight glorification of her. At the end of the day, it's all down to personal taste.

Quote from Peggy at Cropredy 2008 (I think):- "Don't ever forget her; she was the best".

Having the occasional guest makes sure we don't forget. Having a permanent female might risk charges of 'pastiche' IMO.

I agree with all of that, especially the 'stagnant', the 'exciting boost', and the 'uncomfortable' bits!

Jules

Thirded.

At this rate this post might win a Hancock...