Grateful Dead - where next?

[davidmjs]

We are everywhere...  

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1293649/Justin-Timberlake-reveals-love-Grateful-Dead-goes-jog-New-York.html

[tullist/raymond]

We are everywhere...  

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1293649/Justin-Timberlake-reveals-love-Grateful-Dead-goes-jog-New-York.html

There is a chance that he just thinks its an attractive symbol but who knows. I feel certain that at the apex of their popularity 20 or 25 years ago I recall folks buying that symbol for similar reasons that, Americans at least, used to afix the STP oil sticker on their sports or other car. Anyway, he's the guy that used to be married to or boyfriend of Brittney Spears right? There have been other people who I was surprised, and frankly would prefer not to have known,were, if not Deadheads, people who have seen them, most unsettlingly, infamous American right wing pundit, writer, etc, Anne Coulter.

[davidmjs]

We are everywhere...  

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-1293649/Justin-Timberlake-reveals-love-Grateful-Dead-goes-jog-New-York.html

There is a chance that he just thinks its an attractive symbol but who knows. I feel certain that at the apex of their popularity 20 or 25 years ago I recall folks buying that symbol for similar reasons that, Americans at least, used to afix the STP oil sticker on their sports or other car. Anyway, he's the guy that used to be married to or boyfriend of Brittney Spears right? There have been other people who I was surprised, and frankly would prefer not to have known,were, if not Deadheads, people who have seen them, most unsettlingly, infamous American right wing pundit, writer, etc, Anne Coulter.

I think the best one was David Beckham wearing a Crass t-shirt a few years back!  I'm sure Justin hasn't a clue what he's wearing...he's probably berating his stylist as we speak.  But still, if it gets the Daily Mail talking about the Dead it can't be all bad.  Possibly.

And, sad as some of us might think it, there's no shortage of Deadheads on the Right of the political spectrum...that hippie 'libertarianism' for want of a better word was never a 'liberal' preserve....

[quodlibet (Ian)]

Now I could check but as you're here...how much in total, Jules?

I think he said £29.99 including postage.  It's a 4 disc job this time remember, so not so bad.

Jules

Looks like a great package.

Just checked Deadnet & with postage to the UK it works out about £24. Customs charges only kick in on items above £18 (postages costs don't count). Over the donkey's years I've used them, I've had two problems with orders. Both were resolved promptly & without quibble. So, speak as you find. Even with foreign transaction fees, it still works out marginally cheaper.

Awaiting my chum's return from the US with a copy the Philadelphia CD/DVD set, avoiding the somewhat inflated postal charges.

Did we not raise the limit from £18 to about £100 a year or two back?

Well, yes & no, according to HMRC:

No excise duty (on cds, anyway). No Customs duty under £120. Import VAT duty kicks in on items over £18. I thought there were plans afoot to increase this amount, but can't recall details & it was some time ago. Anyway, link for details below.

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/customs/post/buying.htm#1

Not quite as quick as spin, perhaps, but from source, RT Vol.3, No.3 ( Fillmore East, 15/05/70) arrived this morning. Two copies ordered which should, in theory have attracted VAT, but happily, whoever filled out the Customs declaration scrawled the price illegibly & no surcharge was applied. Result  

[Jules Gray]

Not quite as quick as spin, perhaps, but from source, RT Vol.3, No.3 ( Fillmore East, 15/05/70) arrived this morning. Two copies ordered which should, in theory have attracted VAT, but happily, whoever filled out the Customs declaration scrawled the price illegibly & no surcharge was applied. Result  

Good man yerself, Ian!

Jules

[MikeB (Mike)]

Careful, we have a HM Revenue & Customs employee around these parts, I think.

[Jules Gray]

Careful, we have a HM Revenue & Customs employee around these parts, I think.

Can't we just bribe him.  

Jules

[quodlibet (Ian)]

Careful, we have a HM Revenue & Customs employee around these parts, I think.

Come & get me rozzers. You'll never take me alive  

[Jules Gray]

Careful, we have a HM Revenue & Customs employee around these parts, I think.

Come & get me rozzers. You'll never take me alive  

That's right - he ain't goin' dahhhn for this caper, you muppets!  Even if he is banged to rights.  My boy ain't doin' no stir.

Jules

[quodlibet (Ian)]

Careful, we have a HM Revenue & Customs employee around these parts, I think.

Come & get me rozzers. You'll never take me alive  

That's right - he ain't goin' dahhhn for this caper, you muppets!  Even if he is banged to rights.  My boy ain't doin' no stir.

Jules

From the band introductions on the new Road Trips:

Bill Graham: "From 710 Ashbury Street, Mr Jerry Garcia":

JG: "They'll never take me alive".

Thus proving definitively that space truly is deep  

[Jules Gray]

From the band introductions on the new Road Trips:

Bill Graham: "From 710 Ashbury Street, Mr Jerry Garcia":

JG: "They'll never take me alive".

Thus proving definitively that space truly is deep  

And the similarly delightful exchange between Jerry and the girl in the audience wanting to know where his beard has gone, to which he replies "I don't ask you about your beard!".  Wonderful.

Jules

[PaulT]

OK - slightly off topic here, but... I spotted a remastered edition of the Dylan/Dead CD over the weekend for £3 (in RISE).

I've never actually heard this album, but I've read that it's truly awful - now, was it the sound quality of the original, or the recording quality, or the playing and/or singing that made/make it so bad? Is it worth £3?

[quodlibet (Ian)]

OK - slightly off topic here, but... I spotted a remastered edition of the Dylan/Dead CD over the weekend for £3 (in RISE).

I've never actually heard this album, but I've read that it's truly awful - now, was it the sound quality of the original, or the recording quality, or the playing and/or singing that made/make it so bad? Is it worth £3?

It was a bit muddy, soundwise & perhaps not the happiest of performances, but for £3? Yes, just about, but manage your expectations. There are much better documents of the tour around & the rehearsals have some really nice moments.

[samnitzberg (Sam)]

OK, I've just stumbled upon this thread, had no idea it was going on for some reason.  I've been a Dead fan since 1969 - I was 12, into folk music, and heard Workingman's Dead, and was hooked.  (Probably about the same time I discovered Fairport.)  Saw them many times starting in 1975, and the last time was during the Dylan and The Dead tour, in Washington DC.  I believe it was a few days before Jerry went into the coma. So I'd like to put in my 2 cents.  It was a horrible show, and that Dylan and the Dead album captures it perfectly.

But while I'm here, I'd like to give you all my favorites list (in case there's someone still looking for recommendations for places to start), starting with what I consider their best album:
Europe '72 - The reason it's so good is that they re-recorded 90% of the vocals in the studio (sorry if this has been touched on here - I could read through all 20 or so pages).  They set up their instrument amps exactly like they had done on stage during that tour and piped through all their individual parts, and then sang over that.  So the harmonies are immeasurably better than they could ever actually pull off live. They had done similar live/studio combinations within a song earlier (Skull & Roses and Anthem of the Sun) but never as a plan of attack for a whole release.  It's everything I think they hoped they would sound like live.
And in no particular order, because it would change tomorrow:
Mars Hotel
American Beauty
Workingman's Dead
Skull & Roses
Wake of the Flood
Anthem of the Sun
Blues for Allah- they go to the brink of being a progressive jazz band, but it seems they decided against it

Of the myriad From The Vault and Dick's Picks and other later-on releases of live shows, may I heartily recommend the first one ("One From The Vault").  It was their first time back playing after an extended break (which they never did), debuting songs which would appear later on Blues for Allah.  It was a small venue, typical for that era (1975) and was an FM live broadcast at the time, so everyone had a bootleg for many years before they released the CD.

Finally, a must for any collection is Old & In The Way, maybe the best bluegrass album ever recorded, teaming up Garcia and his folkie buddies with Vassar Clements.  Great version of the Stones' Wild Horses.

OK I'm done.

[Jules Gray]

They set up their instrument amps exactly like they had done on stage during that tour and piped through all their individual parts, and then sang over that.  

I'm confused by this part - if they were recording vocals, why did they set up their amps?  And what does "piped through their individual parts" mean?  They re-recorded the instruments too?  Like I sai, I'm confused!  

Jules

[samnitzberg (Sam)]

As I understand it, the live recordings were done on a multi-track system.  Then in the studio each individual instrument track was played through its appropriate amplifier, without the vocals being played back.  They then sang the new vocals, with their vocal mikes picking up the ambient sounds of the amps in the same way that they would in a live setting, and these new vocal tracks replaced the original ones.  No headphones, no isolation, etc., just the ability to make things sound as if it was all done at once.  The main thing is that the instrumental tracks were indeed live, picking the cream, without considering how good or bad the original vocals may have been, of the versions of the songs played on that tour.  There were bootlegs back then of the original recordings (I presume they're still out there in download-land), and it's almost funny to hear the exact same notes being played, but with the usual iffy live vocals.  They never play the a song the same way twice, so it was pretty easy to notice.  There are places on the album where you can hear the difference - where no new vocals were done.

I think that they just wanted to get the same feel as singing live, as opposed to the rather sterile nature of the normal type of overdubbing.

By the way, the other reason I really like Europe '72, as well as American Beauty, Skull & Roses, WOTF and Mars Hotel, is because there's only one drummer on those recordings, Mickey Hart having left the band for 5 years or so, and it makes for a much more precise sound.

[Jules Gray]

So the live recording of the instruments was played back though the amps while they nailed the vocals?  Weird.  But totally cool!

And I think I agree about preferring one drummer.  Especially when that drummer's Bill K.  I know Jerry and Phil get most of the attention from fans and musos for their musical chops, but if I had to nominate one of the Dead for my top player award it might well be Bill.  He's phenomenally good, night after night after night.

Jules

[samnitzberg (Sam)]

From Wikipedia: "Although Europe '72 is billed as a live album, the songs featured on the release were subject to significant overdubs after the fact, specifically with respect to the lush harmony vocals. Unadulterated multitrack recordings of the performances used for the album are no longer available (because they were simply snipped from the multitrack concert tapes whereupon the band overdubbed directly onto them, destroying the originals) but, for example, the available two-track soundboard recording of the May 10, 1972 show indicates the band had not yet figured out the vocal arrangements for "He's Gone" that would later be overdubbed in the United States."

And yup, glad it was Kreutzmann.  He's got some great comments in the movie about how when he plays it's like dancing.

[Jules Gray]

the available two-track soundboard recording of the May 10, 1972 show indicates the band had not yet figured out the vocal arrangements for "He's Gone" that would later be overdubbed in the United States."

Disappointingly, the version of He's Gone on Europe '72 fades early and you don't get the lovely harmonies on the tag section.  I've heard other versions since (eg the wonderful version on disc 3 of Dick's Picks 28 from early '73) that are much closer to being definitive.

Jules

[quodlibet (Ian)]

Amazingly, it's fifteen years today since Jerry's demise.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AX9Vhv4akxc&feature=related