Simon Says....

[bassline (Mike)]

The nearest parallel to Cropredy that I can think of is Beautiful Days (no corporate sponsorship, the leveller’s festival, etc). From my recent attendances, I’d guess that their average audience age is c10 years or so younger than Cropredy. I think their numbers are capped at 10,000. In my opinion, their line-up is streets ahead of Cropredy this year, with something for everyone (as a side-note, we were amongst the oldest at a sold-out and heaving Longest Johns gig of c600; brilliant band!). Im pretty sure that their ticket sales are v healthy from what I’ve heard. I think my point is that once your unique selling point (for Cropredy it is/was the band, the fantastic location and a great chance to catch up with old friends) is no longer the main draw, lineup is everything.

That's true, but BD is a multistage event on a bigger site, so they are able to cover a wider range of music, more choice and attract a wider demographic.
The Levellers came to prominence a good 20-30 years after Fairport, and actually had enough top 40 hits to make a bona fide Greatest Hits album.
Most of the acts tend to be 80's, 90's and 00's, give or take the odd Hawkwind or Van Der Graf, so they have that advantage too.
The year Cropredy had Supergrass on did not go too well on the feral yoof front.

Excellent point, Mike, re: multiple stages, which I hadn’t considered. Is Cropredy the only festival with one stage?

That depends on the size of the festival, generally.
The bigger festivals tend to have multi-stages, dance tents, cabaret tents and so on.
Smaller, folky type fests will have one or two.
Cropredy, as David pointed out, used to be mostly FC off shoots with Fairport as the climax to the weekend.
The 'fringe' used to be pub bands in the two, well, pubs, if you weren't interested in the act on the main stage.
That has now took on a surrogate alternative role to the actual event, with bigger names to draw you away from the main stage.
The Thursday headliner now has more importance than Fairport, and that's sad.

I can't see a new generation of Fairport fans coming in to replace us, - instead, new attendees are coming to hear top 40 hits from some Eighties act. Get Boy George or Bananananananarama on and it will probably sell loads.
They aren't Cropredy music.

Since the onset of the sea of chairs, I find myself with the choice of either being at the front or the back.
Obviously, people at the front are there to enjoy the music.
If I am at the back, there is hardly anybody engaged in the music at all.
They are having a picnic or chatting or whatever.
They only pay attention when there's a 'hit.'
'Oh, I know this one !'
It doesn't even have to be the original artist.
'Two Tribes' and 'Relax' may get them excited, but Frankie Goes To Hollywood have never been near the stage.
Maybe Trev will bring Holly on this year.

(I have Frankie, Culture Club and 'Nana records b.t.w, but this is Fairport's gig.)
(As another b.t.w, I have yet to see the Levellers at Beautiful Days..one year I watched Alison Moyet in the Big Top instead.)

[ColinB]

That's true, but BD is a multistage event on a bigger site, so they are able to cover a wider range of music, more choice and attract a wider demographic.
The Levellers came to prominence a good 20-30 years after Fairport, and actually had enough top 40 hits to make a bona fide Greatest Hits album.
Most of the acts tend to be 80's, 90's and 00's, give or take the odd Hawkwind or Van Der Graf, so they have that advantage too.
The year Cropredy had Supergrass on did not go too well on the feral yoof front.

Excellent point, Mike, re: multiple stages, which I hadn’t considered. Is Cropredy the only festival with one stage?

Folk By The Oak started off as a one stage festival but they then added a small second stage which I think has bands on during the breaks between acts on the main stage. But then it is just a one day festival.

I haven't been to the Underneath the Stars festival but I'm wondering if it has similarities to Cropredy as it is centred round one artist, in this case Kate Rusby. From a quick look at its website it looks like they have two stages. Not a bad line up this year though I'm not familiar with The Feeling who headline on the Saturday.

The Bar-Steward Sons of Val Doonican are playing with their latest recruit the Rt Rev J R Doonican III aka Jamie Roberts.

https://www.underneaththestarsfest.co.uk/line-up

[Metro96 (Keith)]

That's true, but BD is a multistage event on a bigger site, so they are able to cover a wider range of music, more choice and attract a wider demographic.
The Levellers came to prominence a good 20-30 years after Fairport, and actually had enough top 40 hits to make a bona fide Greatest Hits album.
Most of the acts tend to be 80's, 90's and 00's, give or take the odd Hawkwind or Van Der Graf, so they have that advantage too.
The year Cropredy had Supergrass on did not go too well on the feral yoof front.

Excellent point, Mike, re: multiple stages, which I hadn’t considered. Is Cropredy the only festival with one stage?

Folk By The Oak started off as a one stage festival but they then added a small second stage which I think has bands on during the breaks between acts on the main stage. But then it is just a one day festival.

I haven't been to the Underneath the Stars festival but I'm wondering if it has similarities to Cropredy as it is centred round one artist, in this case Kate Rusby. From a quick look at its website it looks like they have two stages. Not a bad line up this year though I'm not familiar with The Feeling who headline on the Saturday.

The Bar-Steward Sons of Val Doonican are playing with their latest recruit the Rt Rev J R Doonican III aka Jamie Roberts.

https://www.underneaththestarsfest.co.uk/line-up

Underneath the Stars does have two stages (Big Top Tents). But there is only one act on at a time.

[Will S]

Maybe they should announce who the special guest is going to be.

That seems very pertinent.

Although it could, depending on who they are, actually make things worse?  A shrug of the shoulders is probably not what is needed here?

My feeling (as I think I mentioned before) is that it will be someone who is a (reasonably) big name, but they will only do a 20 min slot just before Fairport (or with Fairport?), and if they named them, there would be complaints from people who bought tickets expecting to see a full set.  I may, of course, be completely wrong... (it has been known).

[davidmjs]

Maybe they should announce who the special guest is going to be.

That seems very pertinent.

Although it could, depending on who they are, actually make things worse?  A shrug of the shoulders is probably not what is needed here?

My feeling (as I think I mentioned before) is that it will be someone who is a (reasonably) big name, but they will only do a 20 min slot just before Fairport (or with Fairport?), and if they named them, there would be complaints from people who bought tickets expecting to see a full set.  I may, of course, be completely wrong... (it has been known).

I think I'm right in saying that previously announced 'special guests' have always played with Fairport, not as a separate unbilled act.  I can't think of any exceptions to that - can anyone?

[David W]

Big Country were billed as "special guests" back in 2012 but ...

DW

[davidmjs]

Big Country were billed as "special guests" back in 2012 but ...

DW

So named on the bill, but described as 'special guests'?

[Andy]

Maybe they should announce who the special guest is going to be.

That seems very pertinent.

Although it could, depending on who they are, actually make things worse?  A shrug of the shoulders is probably not what is needed here?

I can't help but feel that if announcing the guest would enhance ticket sales, they'd have done it by now.

[PaulT]

I wonder if reverting to the 2-day format might be worth consideration?

[davidmjs]

I wonder if reverting to the 2-day format might be worth consideration?

The trouble with that is that the Thursday in the village (which used to be a highpoint of the festivals for me) has been ruined by the pubs wanting their own festivals and charging for them....

[Lubiloo (Lorna)]

Maybe they should announce who the special guest is going to be.

That seems very pertinent.

Although it could, depending on who they are, actually make things worse?  A shrug of the shoulders is probably not what is needed here?

My feeling (as I think I mentioned before) is that it will be someone who is a (reasonably) big name, but they will only do a 20 min slot just before Fairport (or with Fairport?), and if they named them, there would be complaints from people who bought tickets expecting to see a full set.  I may, of course, be completely wrong... (it has been known).

I think I'm right in saying that previously announced 'special guests' have always played with Fairport, not as a separate unbilled act.  I can't think of any exceptions to that - can anyone?

Roger Hodgson?

[bassline (Mike)]

He was an unannounced surprise guest with FC, like Gary Brooker, Joe Brown, Planty, Roy Wood before him.
Also Yusuf Stevens, except he let the 'Cat' out of the bag himself.

[Lubiloo (Lorna)]

He was an unannounced surprise guest with FC, like Gary Brooker, Joe Brown, Planty, Roy Wood before him.
Also Yusuf Stevens, except he let the 'Cat' out of the bag himself.

So many different categories of surprise guests! Yes, he was indeed of the ‘unannounced, surprise’ category as opposed to the normal ‘surprise’ category or the ‘un-named special guest’ category etc…..

[Shane (Skirky)]

The nearest parallel to Cropredy that I can think of is Beautiful Days (no corporate sponsorship, the leveller’s festival, etc). From my recent attendances, I’d guess that their average audience age is c10 years or so younger than Cropredy. I think their numbers are capped at 10,000. In my opinion, their line-up is streets ahead of Cropredy this year, with something for everyone (as a side-note, we were amongst the oldest at a sold-out and heaving Longest Johns gig of c600; brilliant band!). Im pretty sure that their ticket sales are v healthy from what I’ve heard. I think my point is that once your unique selling point (for Cropredy it is/was the band, the fantastic location and a great chance to catch up with old friends) is no longer the main draw, lineup is everything.

That's true, but BD is a multistage event on a bigger site, so they are able to cover a wider range of music, more choice and attract a wider demographic.
The Levellers came to prominence a good 20-30 years after Fairport, and actually had enough top 40 hits to make a bona fide Greatest Hits album.
Most of the acts tend to be 80's, 90's and 00's, give or take the odd Hawkwind or Van Der Graf, so they have that advantage too.
The year Cropredy had Supergrass on did not go too well on the feral yoof front.

Equally, BDs is a non-sponsored festival, capped at 17.5K attendees and with the extra cost of the infrastructure needed to put on all those extra stages, weekend prices are pretty comparable and they’ve (significantly, I think) already sold out all the camper van tickets. I think it’s about the line-up.

[davidmjs]

The nearest parallel to Cropredy that I can think of is Beautiful Days (no corporate sponsorship, the leveller’s festival, etc). From my recent attendances, I’d guess that their average audience age is c10 years or so younger than Cropredy. I think their numbers are capped at 10,000. In my opinion, their line-up is streets ahead of Cropredy this year, with something for everyone (as a side-note, we were amongst the oldest at a sold-out and heaving Longest Johns gig of c600; brilliant band!). Im pretty sure that their ticket sales are v healthy from what I’ve heard. I think my point is that once your unique selling point (for Cropredy it is/was the band, the fantastic location and a great chance to catch up with old friends) is no longer the main draw, lineup is everything.

That's true, but BD is a multistage event on a bigger site, so they are able to cover a wider range of music, more choice and attract a wider demographic.
The Levellers came to prominence a good 20-30 years after Fairport, and actually had enough top 40 hits to make a bona fide Greatest Hits album.
Most of the acts tend to be 80's, 90's and 00's, give or take the odd Hawkwind or Van Der Graf, so they have that advantage too.
The year Cropredy had Supergrass on did not go too well on the feral yoof front.

Equally, BDs is a non-sponsored festival, capped at 17.5K attendees and with the extra cost of the infrastructure needed to put on all those extra stages, weekend prices are pretty comparable and they’ve (significantly, I think) already sold out all the camper van tickets. I think it’s about the line-up.

I think the significant difference is that, from the off, BD has been a festival that everybody knows is the Levellers' but it's been deliberately curated to appeal to a much wider audience than just their own, and the different venues permit (even encourage) that.  Unfortunately, the one stage setup in the current festival market just looks far too restrictive...and they've now lost that option because others in the village are offering that alternative and raking off the profits associated with it... opportunity lost.

[Shane (Skirky)]

@davidmjs #word 👍

[Wandering Steve]

Maybe they should announce who the special guest is going to be.

That seems very pertinent.

Although it could, depending on who they are, actually make things worse?  A shrug of the shoulders is probably not what is needed here?

I agree with this
If ticket sales are slow but you have one excellent joker in the pack left to play knowing that him / she /they would be the draw needed to sell the tickets you’d be announcing it by now….
The fact it’s not been announced sets alarm bells ringing.

Let’s all donate a tenner each to a just giving page to get a top act booked if it saves the future of the festival
I understand the act may not please everyone but a £10 donation and you get a patch/badge showing you helped support the festival.
If I had to pay a tenner to help buy an act and help the festival sell out I wouldn’t hesitate…,
Is that feasible or bonkers?

[Shane (Skirky)]

Also, not to decry the business model, but if you do want to see the band play, it’s not like there aren’t two tours a year where you can see them in a more convenient (seated) venue closer to home.

[Andy]

Is that feasible or bonkers?

Well, it's not feasible for 2024 because any good acts have been booked up for this summer for months. A lot of acts are already getting booked for 2025.

As to 2026 and beyond, who knows? That's 2 years hence and when you look at events in the last 2, a helluva lot can happen in that time.

[bassline (Mike)]

Also, not to decry the business model, but if you do want to see the band play, it’s not like there aren’t two tours a year where you can see them in a more convenient (seated) venue closer to home.

I may be wrong, but I think I remember Peggy saying that Cropredy is the means by which the funds to finance the tours, album and DVD releases and merch is raised.
Probably to fund the next years festival too.

I can't remember the interview, but Peggy looked worried that there wasn't going to be much of a walk up on the weekend.